Nielsen’s Stacie De Armas And Actor Robin De Jesús On Latino TV Representation

Robin de Jesús is a hot actor coming off rave reviews for his performance in Lin-Manuel Miranda’s production of tick, tick…BOOM! Stacie de Armas, Nielsen’s Senior Vice President, Diverse Intelligence & Initiatives, has been named one of the most powerful and influential Latinos in entertainment.

These two Hollywood powerhouses come together to share thoughts after Nielsen released a study entitled “Being Seen on Screen: The Importance of Quantity and Quality Representation on TV.” The report finds that on-screen diversity is at an all-time high across cable, broadcast, and streaming platforms. It also notes that almost a quarter of viewers surveyed believe that representation is inaccurate.

This Q&A has been edited for brevity and clarity.

Stacie, what surprises you most in the latest Nielsen Diverse Intelligence series report?

Stacie de Armas: Just how incredible Spanish language television is at bringing forward great intersectional representation both of Afro Latinos and LGBTQ Latinos—as well as gender representation. The flip side is that we don’t see much in English language TV. These are two different stories. I don’t want to discount the importance of either of them.

When you look at the report overall, you see this big number in broadcast television, right? Wow, 22% [share of screen among the top 10 recurring cast members]. That’s remarkable. But as you peel the layers back, it looks a bit different. Representation on English language broadcast TV is just about 6%. That’s disappointing, as we Latinos make up nearly 20% of the U.S. population.

Does the presence of Spanish language media let general market TV off the hook?

Stacie de Armas: I don’t think so. They’re discrete and different. In Spanish language television, you have this wonderful gender representation and great coverage of genres. If you think about how people are presented, you can be anything—a newscaster, an action hero, a doctor, or a lawyer. Because the environment is all in Spanish, you tend to have Latinos. There is still room for better representation among Afro or Asian Latinos.

But English language television, still the most watched, is so limited. You don’t see those big roles where Latinos are informing the public, helping solve that crime, or showing who we can be and that we deserve to find love and be married.

Even with the inclusion of Spanish language content, overall [Hispanic/Latinx] representation is about 10%. It’s still dramatically low. That gives you a picture of just how dismal representation is on all TV, regardless of where you’re getting your content.

Robin, you’ve been acting for over 20 years. What it been like for you as a creative?

Robin de Jesús: The thing that is most humbling to me—and repeatedly shocking—is the way white supremacy presents itself in different ways. You get to a point in your career, and you think, ‘Oh, I beat that’ and then you enter another room. The bulk of my work starting out was with people of color. Norwalk, Connecticut, my hometown, did have a large Latino community. I grew up in a place of ‘we all help one another.’ I knew community was important, but I didn’t realize it was a choice.

When I got to New York and started working with Black and Brown folks, I was so happy. Then the career got better, stronger. I got more work. The rooms got wider, less diverse, and predominantly white. In my 20s, I found myself shrinking. Now in my 30s, it took me a while to unpack all that stuff. I had to connect with my mental, spiritual, and physical health to really figure things out.

It’s interesting to observe the conversations we’re having, as if they’re new. As if, when I got here 20 years ago, I wasn’t being told by people in the business, ‘Oh, it’s a really good time for you, as a person of color.’ There has been an uptick in representation, obviously, but I keep walking into a room that looks different, but is the same.

Do these new distribution avenues like Apple TV, Hulu, Peacock, and Paramount present more opportunities?

Stacie de Armas: There’s absolutely more opportunities. We’re finding that inclusive creative content itself is a draw. Because there are more platforms, more content is getting greenlit. Let me be clear to Robin’s point. There are still tremendous barriers—but there are more opportunities. The data nerds are connecting the dots. Representation on screen is delivering an audience. We’re able to see that people are drawn to more diverse content. With numbers, we can underscore the revenue potential the content can bring. That’s what is making things change. I hate to say that everyone’s not doing it for the right reason, because of course, that’s what we want. But what we’re attempting to do at Nielsen is connect the dots between diverse content and what people really want. Often, we think of data as a tool for investing and making money. But it can also be a tool for change.

Robin de Jesús: The other interesting thing happening in the industry over the last couple years has been the centering of the actor, which has become an avoidance as to what’s happening on the creative end. The numbers are worse behind the camera. Jumping to the actor feels like skipping steps.

Stacie de Armas: You’re totally right, Robin. All the big yearend reports talk about representation on screen. But that is only one part—and it’s a very visible fix. Behind the screen are the creatives that oftentimes make on-camera representation possible.

The Nielsen study says 3.8 million Americans—or 6% of the total U.S. Hispanic population and nearly 8% of the entire Black population—identify as Afro Latinos. 1.1 million—or nearly 2% of all U.S. Hispanics— consider themselves Asian Latinos. How do we make sure these groups are visible on television?

Stacie de Armas: Afro Latino representation on cable is still less than 1%. I can tell you what we can do on our end at Nielsen, which is to keep sharing that data. The more we make that visible, the more people will know what the representation looks like, what the community looks like, and the gap between them. That’s our part. Then, we hope to inspire not just the industry, but advocacy groups and others to continue to carry this message.

Last year, there was a huge narrative about the importance of visibility of Afro Latinos—one of the first times I can remember it being that loud. It inspired us to look at our data and see how we can offer support with a narrative. But this is much bigger than a couple of data points. It’s about America realizing how much greater we are as a people when we bring forward stories from all our different intersectional backgrounds.

Robin de Jesús: Data science is storytelling. It’s just a different perspective. I’m really big on language because words cast spells. When we talk about Afro Latinos, it’s interesting how that word is being dissected.

I’m Afro Latino. But I also have a very close proximity to whiteness. My dad is a Puerto Rican with red hair and freckles. My grandparents were black, and it’s all biological. I’m a quarter Black, but I look white. We keep talking about Afro Latino representation, but the conversation is actually about colorism. It’s about darkness. Because if you want to talk about Afro Latinos being represented, well, then I’m here. So that’s not specific enough. A huge chunk of people miss out on that. We must be really, really specific when we talk about Latinos—and when we talk about Black folks and demographics—that we go out of our way to say non-Black Latinos or Black Latinos. There’s so much confusion and so much frustration.

Stacie de Armas: There are so few pieces of content for our community, for representing our 40 different countries or for representing Afro Latinos and Asian Latinos. There are so few pieces of content that are written by, produced by, and about us that the pressure of all of the representation goes on one piece of content. The issue isn’t a piece of content—it’s there needs to be more.

Stacie de Armas and Robin de Jesús continue the conversation on a panel moderated by the founding executive director of the New York Latino Film Festival, Calixto Chinchilla.

Listen to The Revolución Podcast full episode featuring Stacie de Armas and Robin de Jesús with co-hosts Kathryn Garcia Castro, Diego Lastra, and Court Stroud, on Apple Podcasts, iHeartMedia, Spotify, Google Podcasts, Amazon Podcasts, or by clicking here.